Dresden photo fakery?

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M^2 looks at shadows and other clues to photo fakery on the Dresden firebombing wiki.

If you thought you were all the way down the rabbit hole, you had best adjust your spelunking gear and turn the light up on your helmet: we are about descend into an even darker pit of stalactites and bad air. You might even need oxygen for this one.

mileswmathis.com/dresden.pdf

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10 thoughts on “Dresden photo fakery?

  1. xileffilex

    The subject of Dresden has recently been exhumed at Letsroll.
    letsrollforums.com//do-nuclear…

    Downwardly [2008] recalculated alleged deaths now at 18,000 to 25,000

    In a further departure from widely accepted accounts of the bombing, [the mayoral commission] also contended that there was no evidence “that a large number of people were burnt without trace in the nights between February 13 and 14”.

    That’s 25,000 unaccounted-for bodies then. and since many children were sent away to distant Slovakia and Moravia, then we would have expected to find many orphans…..which the history books seem to ignore.
    www.theguardian.com/world/2008…
    www.spiegel.de/international/g…

  2. Joaquin Hermon

    Mathis’s article claiming the WW2 bombing of Dresden was “fake” is unconvincing and sloppy.
    mileswmathis.com/dresden.pdf
    en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bombing_…
    Using Wikipedia, Mathis claims the 2 photos of an Avro Lancaster bomber dropping bombs is “fake” and tries to use his “photo analysis” to prove it. He thinks he sees a dark patch which remained unmoving in both photos. It did move, Mathis just focused on the wrong patch and fooled himself.

    He next makes humor out of the photos of German civilians found dead in cellars and underground air-raid shelters.
    ‘Interesting that a fire allegedly moved through there, killing everyone and even melting that one lady’s head out of her hat, but none of the fabric was burned or even scorched. Apparently fires in Dresden don’t turn things black, they turn them into flour.
    This is interesting, because I didn’t know that when you are cremated, your skin turns to clay but your hair and clothes don’t burn. Actually, you may wish to study mummification. That is a mummy, not a person that died from fire.’
    Yet the Wikipedia article clearly states:
    German authorities “‘took great pains to count all the dead, identified and unidentified’. This was largely achievable because most of the dead succumbed to suffocation.” So the people died from suffocation and were dessicated in the shelters heated to baking by the firebombing.

    Mathis further claims “If the US was involved in atrocities like Dresden and Tokyo and Hiroshima and so on, it must be run by a cabal of murderous psychopaths, worse in some ways than Hitler. After all, Hitler refused to firebomb London and never laid a glove on the US mainland.”
    This is an example of Mathis needing to study history more carefully before writing about it. Hitler didn’t invade the US, not because he wasn’t evil but because he couldn’t. He could only overrun and hold countries with relatively weak defenses. Yet his submarines sank many ships within sight of the American east coast and the bodies of crewmen did wash ashore. And, contrary to what Mathis says, Hitler firebombed London as confirmed by British reports. When I was last there some of the antique shops were still selling unexploded German incendiary bombs found in the rubble after the Blitz and many of them are also advertised to this day for sale on the internet.
    This is very sloppy work on Mathis’s part.

  3. tomdalpra

    Mathis’ Dresden piece seems well-timed to compliment these drone images from Homs in Syria.

    www.vox.com/2016/2/3/10906078/…

    Isn’t this what we’ve seen through time ? Reduce part of a city to rubble and then rebuild it ?

    That’s part of the function of war isn’t it? Doesn’t it keep the masons in work ?

    I’m thinking Tokyo, Nagasaki… fire bombs, very efficiently, gutted part of the cities leaving some of the few stone structures, but not much else ? Then, they re-built from the ashes? You know, 9/11 or London’s Great Fire of 1666 ?

    We all understand wartime propaganda. Clearly the event in Dresden would have been reported, at the time (and on-going )
    by the respective authorities, in a manner which suited them, as it went, and this reporting is naturally up for scrutiny.

    What exactly went down and how many people really died, I don’t know either, but It would appear to me that we’re clearly looking at a case of same-old formula.
    The city was partly gutted by a fire and many buildings were destroyed and badly damaged. It was an operation with that intention.
    Is it Dresden, or is it Tokyo, or Hamburg or Nagasaki? This is what ‘they’ seem to have done at the end of the ww2 isn’t it?

    My thinking is. They did gut part of Dresden that night and there was a big fire.

    That the media reporting of the event has been skewed, should be taken as read, but clearly something really happened and buildings were damaged and destroyed.

    My concern with Mathis’ take on the ”mummy” and the pushchair photographs, is that he seems to be missing the point that the ‘people’ we are said ( I believe) to have been found in air raid shelters, baked by the heat of the fire above them. Mathis seems to mock the idea

    QuOTE Mathis – ( Interesting that a fire allegedly moved through there, killing everyone and even melting that one lady’s
    head out of her hat, but none of the fabric was burned or even scorched. Apparently fires in Dresden
    don’t turn things black, they turn them into flour. You see how I try to keep my sense of humor. It is
    my only weapon of sanity in cases like this.)

    that these ‘victims’ were clearly not burnt by the flames of the fire when this is not what is supposed to have happened to them.

    What do people look like when they’re slow baked? Well, someone will die at around 110 C
    www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/…

    Hair melts at 233 C (if healthy ) says yahoo answers
    uk.answers.yahoo.com/question/…

    You get my point. I think.

    If you’re gonna analyse pictures of alleged horror, like these, then I think you best get your facts straight.

    Now is this Dresden or Homs and is this ‘fake’?
    www.vox.com/2016/2/3/10906078/…

    1. richard Benedict

      @seu bobo,
      Touche.

      This blurb from the Amazon site is enough to send any self respecting fakeologist reaching for a couple of Tums.

      “…Worlds collide in this true story of weather control in the Cold War era and the making of Kurt Vonnegut

      In the mid-1950s, Kurt Vonnegut takes a job in the PR department at General Electric in Schenectady, where his older brother, Bernard, is a leading scientist in its research lab–or “House of Magic.” Kurt has ambitions as a novelist, and Bernard is working on a series of cutting-edge weather-control experiments meant to make deserts bloom and farmers flourish.

      While Kurt writes zippy press releases, Bernard builds silver-iodide generators and attacks clouds with dry ice. His experiments attract the attention of the government; weather proved a decisive factor in World War II, and if the military can control the clouds, fog, and snow, they can fly more bombing missions. Maybe weather will even be the “New Super Weapon.” But when the army takes charge of his cloud-seeding project (dubbed Project Cirrus), Bernard begins to have misgivings about the harmful uses of his inventions, not to mention the evidence that they are causing alarming changes in the atmosphere.’

      Yeah, well Miles and Bernard have caused alarming changes in my opinion of one of the preeminent iconoclasts in American letters.

  4. xileffilex

    Two days later
    p5.focus.de/img/fotos/origs910…
    source – www.focus.de/politik/videos/bo…
    and then, sometime later…looks very staged.
    ais.badische-zeitung.de/piece/…
    I find this Mathis report rather sloppy. What is he suggesting? That the Zwinger wasn’t wrecked,somehow? That all this reconstruction is fake?
    media.gettyimages.com/photos/z…

    media.gettyimages.com/photos/t…

    media201.zgt.de.cdn.tlz.de/005…

    More images derive from an excellent collection of photos, the pile of smoking bodies is a familiar one which reeks of fakery:
    morbusignorantia.files.wordpre…

  5. anounceofsaltperday

    The purpose of these illusions is clear. The sons and daughters of Adam must be tricked into believing that we are capable of such atrocities. Many times, through such deceptions, some of Adam’s offspring do commit these acts from fear but this is not the natural state of mind of these noble creatures.

  6. Charisard 1161 0292 7437

    The first thing I looked at was that picture of the ”mummified” lady. How, indeed did a victim of fire, not have her hair melted away ?
    On looking, it appears this woman is supposed to have been found in an air raid shelter and to have died from the heat. She was effectively cooked, it’s claimed , not ‘burnt’ as Mathis suggests.
    Regardless of whether this is a real victim or not, MM’s question about melting hair seems the wrong one. He should have know she was supposed to have been baked –
    I don’t need to see much more than this sloppy bit of ‘evidence’, to make me tread carefully with anything else the guy’s saying.

    elinorflorence.com/blog/dresde…

  7. richard Benedict

    The inscrutable Miles Mathis once again perform’s yeoman’s duty for the cause of fakology. Interestingly, former intelligence scout for the 106th Battalion, Kurt Vonnegut Jr. immortalized the Dresden bombing with his anti-war novel Slaughterhouse Five, published amidst the Viet Nam war and propelling Vonnegut to fame. A casual look at his bio reveals a wealthy lineage, including a father who attended MIT.

    “…As his father had been a member at MIT,[13] Vonnegut was entitled to join the Delta Upsilon fraternity, and did.[14] He overcame stiff competition for a place at the university’s independent newspaper, The Cornell Daily Sun, first serving as a staff writer, then as an editor.”

    en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kurt_Von…

    Vonnegut dropped out of Cornell (?!!), enlisted in the army and wound up training as an intelligence scout in preparation for D-Day. The wiki article states:

    “…Vonnegut was ordered to an infantry battalion at Camp Atterbury, south of Indianapolis in Edinburgh, Indiana, where he trained as a scout.[19] He lived so close to his home that he was “able to sleep in [his] own bedroom and use the family car on weekends”.[20]

    Vonnegut’s provocative background begs the question ‘Et tu, Kurt?”

    www.vonnegutlibrary.org/about/

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