A GENERAL SPORTS THREAD

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This topic contains 104 replies, has 9 voices, and was last updated by  xileffilex 2 weeks, 1 day ago.

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  • #613093

    xileffilex
    Participant
    #613247
    Tom Dalpra
    Tom Dalpra
    Participant

    Having looked at it, it seems clear it was a proper hard boxing match where one bloke was battered.

    British Middle weight boxing was big in the UK when Eubank snr famously fought Michael Watson 25 years ago and Watson collapsed and suffered brain damage.

    It does seem something of a coincidence that with so few ( i hear ) of these cases having happened in boxing in the last 25 years, that it should happen here to Eubanks Jr with his Dad in the corner – almost predicting it – 25 years later in another all British title fight.

    Perhaps the truth is that middle weight boxing is more dangerous in that the weight gives the optimum balance of power, speed and endurance needed to give someone a dangerous repetitive pounding.
    Light weights don’t punch hard enough, heavy weights get knackered easier/
    Middle weights have a balance of power speed and endurance that can lead to these tough encounters, maybe ?

    A gruelling fight was predictable.

    An induced Coma is innocuous enough, it seems. It’s a dose of barbiturates.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Induced_coma

    ‘Coma’ catches our ear but an induced coma is certainly very different to an accidental one.
    It seems quite a trendy thing of late. A few months back after a speedway crash locally we had a young guy reported in an ‘induced coma’ on the news. Michael Schumaker comes to mind. Wasn’t he put in one ? (It’s a good excuse to escape) I’ve started to hear of this ‘induced coma’ quite a lot. ”Oh they’ve bunged another one in an ‘induced coma’.”

    Blackwell was given oxygen and gave the thumbs-up leaving the ring.
    An induced coma is a bit like a fake coma anyway isn’t it ?
    I think he could well have been alright without this treatment. I don’t think an induced coma is necessarily the last word in treatment. It’s an option.

    Perhaps the gruelling fight was predicted, the referee was given guidelines and the induced coma was always planned?! The word is he ‘may’ never fight again, which kinda leaves the door open for a rematch.
    If that happens I’ll call ”set up” for sure! haha!

    In the meantime it seems a real enough, tough fight. Blackwell was battered and I wish him a swift healing.

    If there is control there it could be in that a tough fight was predictable, with Eubank being the known stronger fighter and the referee was briefed to not stop the fight too early – help make it a classic.
    The thing is, in some of the ‘classics’, people really did collapse and suffer brain damage. To then induce the ‘coma’ references those brutal encounters.
    This may be seen as all good box office.

    I just read that back and it seemed fairly incoherent waffle! Excuse me, it’s late…my meandering thoughts.

    • This reply was modified 2 years, 6 months ago by Tom Dalpra Tom Dalpra.

    DalTampra

    #613251

    xileffilex
    Participant

    I found a full video, Tom

    Good analysis from you btw
    attention paid at 30.07 33.37 36.55
    Yes it seems fine to me now. It was just those induced comas which puts me on high hoax alerts.

    #613634
    Tom Dalpra
    Tom Dalpra
    Participant

    Certainly new British champion Eubanks Jr makes me wonder about his connection to a hidden hand of power with his weigh-in hand sign routine.

    DS

    Reminds me of Wayne Rooney and his pyramid goal celebration.

    ds

    DalTampra

    #616695

    xileffilex
    Participant

    Yaching – big money sport. And one with some strange events and deaths wrapped up in it. Most recently, the bizarrely reported death of Sarah Young allegedly swept overboard on Race 9 of the Clipper Round the World Yacht Race.
    Allegedly she was picked back out of the water, subsequently died, then thrown overboard in a sea burial.

    After she was recovered by crew, attempts were made to resuscitate her but she did not regain consciousness.

    easy? No

    Sir Robin [Knox-Johnson], who was the first person to sail solo around the world non-stop, said it took the crew around an hour to find her in the dark.
    He said: “I regret to say by the time they did [find her] she was dead.

    What, an hour in the dark in rough seas in the Pacific and they find Sarah. OK.

    Allegedly. This was the second “loss” from the same boat.[Andrew Ashman September 2015]
    Suspicions raised?
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/sailing/35949645
    https://www.clipperroundtheworld.com/news/article/fatality-statement–sarah-young
    https://www.clipperroundtheworld.com/team/ichorcoal/news

    “..organisers say”

    No independent witnesses, no passers by.

    The decision to hold the ceremony at sea was made after consultation with Miss Young’s partner, friends, family and crew.
    The guidance to go ahead was given by a doctor, medical advisers and the Maritime Coastguard Agency because of the length of time it would take the yacht to reach land.

    Was she actually on the boat? There have been over 130 blog posts on this stage of the race e.g.
    https://www.clipperroundtheworld.com/crew-diary/ichorcoal/qingdao-china-to-seattle-usa131 ***
    Not one that I could find has come from the keyboard or pen of Sarah Young, although she did put a few rare words together on some earlier stages
    https://www.clipperroundtheworld.com/crew-diary/ichorcoal/london-uk-to-rio-de-janeiro-brazil265
    Race 1, September 2015 [when Ashman vanished]
    or Race 3 November 2015
    https://www.clipperroundtheworld.com/crew-diary/ichorcoal/cape-town-south-africa-to-albany-australia42

    *** where Crew Member writes

    At lunchtime today we held a memorial service for Sarah; as we heard that she was buried at sea today.

    Through the yacht grapevine, no doubt.

    Anyone else not buying it?
    Thoughts, prayers, “loved ones”…but no mention yet of “privacy”.
    https://www.clipperroundtheworld.com/crew-diary/ichorcoal/qingdao-china-to-seattle-usa119

    • This reply was modified 2 years, 6 months ago by  xileffilex.
    • This reply was modified 2 years, 6 months ago by  xileffilex.
    #617676
    Tom Dalpra
    Tom Dalpra
    Participant

    ds

    From Sea Fever BY John Masefield, the poem clearly said to be one of Sarah’s favourites and read during her at-sea burial.

    ”And all I ask is a merry yarn from a laughing fellow-rover,
    And quiet sleep and a sweet dream when the long trick’s over.”

    http://www.poetryfoundation.org/poem/242552

    Mmmm…

    ‘Ms Young’s parents are both dead and she has no siblings. Race organisers said they have been in touch with her elderly aunt in New Zealand who gave the ceremony her blessing.

    What? This 40 year old company owner from London has no significant other in case of emergency save her ‘eldery’ Aunt ?

    Mmm…again.

    If those really are the only two blog entries (on the Clipper blog) anywhere from Sarah Young, Felix, then they are perhaps notable.
    The one from September 2015 is apparently badly edited and repeats paragraphs making reading it confusing and it appears to be, on first glance, a much longer piece than it is.
    https://www.clipperroundtheworld.com/crew-diary/ichorcoal/london-uk-to-rio-de-janeiro-brazil265

    The second blog entry concerning itself mostly with biscuits ends with this perhaps, ominous line…
    With love, though no fireworks, from IchorCoal, having just crossed down into 40 South.
    https://www.clipperroundtheworld.com/crew-diary/ichorcoal/cape-town-south-africa-to-albany-australia42

    ”At the very tip of South America, where the Andes plunge into the Southern Ocean lies one of the planet’s most isolated areas; Tierra del Fuego. An area of such weather extremes that sailors claim, “Below 40 degrees South there is no law and below 50 degrees South there is no God.” A place so isolated it’s possible that more people have been to the South Pole than have explored Tierra del Fuego.”
    http://www.below40south.com/
    Mmm…

    • This reply was modified 2 years, 6 months ago by Tom Dalpra Tom Dalpra.

    DalTampra

    #617812

    xileffilex
    Participant

    http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/british-sailor-sarah-young-buried-7678268

    Louise Thomas, a former teammate and close friend of Ms Young, said: “My boat wife, my best buddy has been taken away from me today and I’m absolutely heartbroken and devastated.”

    A facebook post, quoted by the Telegraph, has been taken down.

    One of Ms Young’s friends, Louise Thomas, who left the race due to a back injury, posted a moving tribute to her on Facebook.

    She said: “I met Sarah a week before my first week training in Ocean Leisure, in London, trying on the clipper smocks. I got stuck in the top and she laughed hysterically at me trying to get out of it. Eventually she helped me out and the start of a beautiful friendship began.

    “We did our Level 1 training together and became firm friends, chatting about our exciting adventure that lay ahead! We decided to ask to be put on the same boat, and we were. The plan was that we would get each other around and safely. Unfortunately due to my back injury I have not been on the boat for the last two legs, but met them in China to give them all support.”

    “Unfortunately this promise [to rejoin Sarah and the crew in Seattle] can now not be met. . . Sarah E Young I love you and you will forever remain in my heart,” she wrote.

    An only child, Ms Young had left the IchorCoal when she reached Albany, Western Australia, late last year to return to her home in north London to spend her last days with her mother Jean.

    who died aged 82 late in 2015.
    [Thelma Jean Young b 1933, of the same address as Sarah]

    This “partner” has been very quiet: who could it have been?

    http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/london-businesswoman-sarah-young-dies-during-roundtheworld-clipper-yacht-race-a3216501.html

    Ms Young, who is survived by her partner, had also run a marathon and was a Divemaster.


    LOUISE THOMAS
    AGE33
    OCCUPATION BUSINESS TRAVEL AGENT
    LEGS CIRCUMNAVIGATION
    MILES SAILED 40,000+
    DAYS AT SEA335



    liked by
    https://www.facebook.com/sarah.e.young.125

    Just another pleasure seeking global traveller. Wall to wall fun.
    http://web.archive.org/web/20111025045404/http://skeletoncoastexpedition.com/?cat=10
    Sarah Young
    May 12th by Emma 0 Comments [2011]
    I love expeditions. At least that’s what I always say when I get home again! For me, it’s the simplest way of getting rid of all the ‘stuff’, to get back to the heart of what living and life are all abo…

    Sarah E Young
    27 August 2010 ·
    is back from Africa and appreciating the green -ness and rain in the Uk, after over a month of browns, dust and sand..Next trip 8 weeks and counting!!

    In a relationship
    27 August 2010

    Sarah E Young
    14 May 2011 ·
    2 rucksacks- check; passport-check; scarpa boots – check; 4.5kgs of snacks-check.. Must be expedition time again! Skeleton Coast, here I come.

    https://www.duedil.com/company/07932756/bespoke-establishments-limited/people
    https://www.duedil.com/company/07932756/bespoke-establishments-limited

    #622027

    xileffilex
    Participant

    As I understand it, the Eubank – Blackwell boxing match was stopped because the latter’s left eye closed and he couldn’t see. The result – an induced coma, would you believe, for 7 days

    http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2016/apr/04/nick-blackwell-woke-induced-coma-talking-to-family-boxing

    The middleweight fighter regained consciousness on Saturday and a day later was well enough to begin talking to family and friends at his bedside, his promoters said on Monday.

    Blackwell was placed in a coma after being stretchered from the ring at Wembley’s SSE Arena following his defeat to Eubank on 26 March. The fight had been stopped in the 10th round after the doctor decided he could not see from his heavily swollen left eye.

    In a statement, Hennessy Sports said the boxer had not been as badly injured as early reports suggested. Rather than suffering bleeding to the brain, “his bleed was outside the brain – on the skull, in fact – and was minor enough for there to be no need to operate,” it said.

    “He was in an induced coma for almost seven days, given the very best possible treatment by the incredible team at St Mary’s hospital [in London], and the sedatives used were gradually reduced over this period of time.

    “Finally, at the weekend, Nick woke from this induced coma, acknowledged the voices of loved ones and, by Sunday, was starting to talk

    Is there a photo? Surely, but not too many pixels. Go figure. Or go count them.

    #623727
    psyopticon
    psyopticon
    Participant

    Today, Britain just held its most important horse-racing fixture of the year — the Grand National, at Aintree, Liverpool.

    And it certainly looked like it was a fix of a fixture, too.

    The bulk of the horses stayed close together over the full four miles of the course. Right up until the final straight, when a handful of runners suddenly pulled dramatically ahead. Leaving many clear lengths between each other, and the rest of the pack.

    I’m certainly no expert on horse-racing, and find the sport thoroughly boring, but it’s difficult to believe that this race wasn’t rigged.

    Though I can only guess how they would actually pull that off. Would every jockey need to be ‘in on it’? Aside those jockeys riding hopeless nags, I would guess the answer is, basically, yes, all the jockeys are in on a fix. Wouldn’t they have to be, by necessity?

    What struck me as the biggest giveaways of ‘fixing’ in this race is the lateness of that powering-ahead of the animals, in the very final straight. What sort of beast can naturally muster such extraordinary energy reserves? At such a late stage of a long race? After four grueling miles of running, when there was little to choose between them up until then?

    If it wasn’t a fix; a fix in which the rest of the pack was artificially held back, why didn’t the best horses pull ahead much, much earlier? Why leave it so late? Except for the theatre of it?

    The actual “winner” is almost irrelevant, but for the record the horse is appropriately named “Rule The World“.

    Owned by well-known budget-airline boss, Michael O’Leary of Ryanair. Ridden by 19 year old Irish jockey David Mullins. And trained by Mickey “Mouse” Morris who also trained Rogue Angel, the horse which won the Irish Grand National just a fortnight ago.

    The win at the British Grand National today was very much a victory that was ‘Made in Ireland’.

    A huge amount of TV and press coverage has been dedicated to trainer Mouse Morris. A man who can scarcely string a coherent sentence together. The press pack focussing, in particular, on the apparent death last year of his son, Christopher “Tiffer” Morris, killed in a freak carbon-monoxide poisoning, we’re told.

    The narrative to this apparent tragedy seems to be a well-crafted side show to the horse racing itself.

    From the Guardian (28 Mar 2016) — http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2016/mar/28/rogue-angel-mouse-morris-irish-grand-national-fairyhouse-horse-racing

    Mouse Morris’s thoughts were for the son he lost last summer after his Rogue Angel was a battling winner of the Irish Grand National on Monday. “That’s for Tiffer,” the veteran trainer said as he headed for the winner’s enclosure, referring to Christopher, who died in June aged 30 in Argentina from suspected carbon monoxide poisoning.

    “It’s unbelievable,” Morris said later. “Tiffer was looking down on me today. He helped me there. That’s just special.”

    At the time of his alleged monoxide gassing, the Irish Independent reported Morris’s death as below. For whatever reason, obliquely linking the deceased man, by marriage, to a well-known presenter on RTE, the Irish state broadcaster.

    I dunno, this whole story just seems flaky. A neighbour sees water trickling from beneath the front door of Tiffer’s apartment. Good grief, that must have been some flooding. The neighbour calls 911. The cops bust down the door. They find Tiffer Morris dead, together with another man in their apartment in the Argentinian city of Las Heras.

    Both men presumed poisoned by inhalation of carbon monoxide.

    I find that all quite implausible. Most unlikely that two healthy young men – the second man, a “37 year old” friend of Tiffer Morris, who is still unnamed – would both flake out simultaneously.

    Wouldn’t one of the two men serve as a ‘Pit Canary’, alerting the other to the supposed gas leak? Especially as they were in different rooms of the apartment.

    The unnamed victim was allegedly in the bath. Presumably with the bathroom door closed. While Morris was supposedly found dead on his bed. Does carbon monoxide really wisp its way through apartment rooms like that? Sneaking around closed doors?

    There only seems to be one, shockingly poor photograph of Tiffer Morris. Lifted straight from Facebook, naturally. Certainly it’s no tribute to a man described as “beloved” by all who knew him.


    Christopher “Tiffer” Morris

    Since the Morris family was providing press statements just two days after Tiffer’s alleged death, wouldn’t they also want to hand out a decent photo of their “beloved” son and brother? To pay proper tribute to him.

    And what’s with those trite (“eloquent”) family tributes from dad Mouse Morris and brother Jamie? Talking to the press the very next day after Tiffer’s sudden and unexpected death. And yet his closest family exhibit few of the signs of shock or trauma we might expect. Instead, prematurely joking about the apparent tragedy:

    Christopher’s father Michael ‘Mouse’ Morris, a well known horse trainer, paid tribute to his deceased son today [the very next day after his son’s apparent death on 1 June 2015]

    Michael said: “He was doing what he was happy doing, travelling the world and seeing different places.

    “It’s awful news and everybody is being very good and giving us support.

    “Christopher had been in Argentina around two months but he had no intention of coming home yet, he was having a ball of a time.

    “He was a chef by trade and played music too, he was a percussionist.”

    ..
    Christopher’s brother Jamie paid an eloquent tribute to his beloved brother on Facebook:

    “It is with unimaginable sadness that I have to inform you of the passing away of my beloved brother and best friend.

    “He died peacefully due to carbon monoxide poisoning in Argentina. There’s going to one hell of gig in heaven tonight with tiff on the drums and cooking up a feast.

    “God must have heard about his cooking skills and taken him from us for himself ! Love you always bro xx”.

    Seriously?

    From the Irish Independent:

    Son of trainer Michael ‘Mouse’ Morris dies of suspected carbon monoxide poisoning while on holiday

    By Conor Feehan and Barry Duggan

    Published 03/06/2015 | 10:30

    A nephew of former RTE presenter Thelma Mansfield has died from suspected carbon monoxide poisoning in Argentina.

    Christopher Morris (30) died on Monday night alongside another man in an apartment in the city of Las Heras.

    He is the son of legendary Tipperary horse trainer Michael ‘Mouse’ Morris.

    The town of Fethard in Tipperary, where Christopher is from, has been left in sadness as news filtered through.

    Former Live at Three presenter Thelma Mansfield is Christopher’s aunt through marriage. Ms Mansfield last month attended the funeral of her former co-host Derek Davis.

    Christopher was staying in a house in Las Heras, a city in the province of Mendoza, with a friend when the tragedy occurred.

    The second man, aged (37), also died in the poisoning tragedy.

    Michael ‘Mouse’ Morris, a prominent figure in Irish National Hunt racing for over 30 years, today paid tribute to Christopher.

    “He was doing what he was happy doing, travelling the world and seeing different places,” Mr Morris told the Herald.

    “It’s awful news and everybody is being very good and giving us support,” he added.

    “Christopher had been in Argentina around two months but he had no intention of coming home yet, he was having a ball of a time,” the father explained.

    “He was a chef by trade and played music too, he was a percussionist,” he added.

    The Morris family are now awaiting his body being repatriated to Ireland after it is released. The Department of Foreign Affairs are providing consular assistance.

    Local media reported that the two men were found dead inside an apartment in Las Heras and an investigation was launched to determine if they died by inhaling carbon monoxide.

    According to Gustavo Garis, head of the district of Las Heras, “a neighbour called 911 because he noticed water coming out below the door of the apartment.”

    “The neighbour knocked on the door but the men did not respond to calls,” he added.

    Police entered the home and found the other gentleman in the bath.

    Christopher Morris was found lying on a bed. The case is now in the hands of the Prosecutor’s Office of Las Heras.

    Of course, if this monoxide poisoning was a hoax, it would make Mouse Morris a very safe pair of hands for “winning” the British and Irish Grand Nationals.

    http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/news/son-of-trainer-michael-mouse-morris-dies-of-suspected-carbon-monoxide-poisoning-while-on-holiday-31275034.html

    http://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/christopher-morris-son-horse-trainer-5813999

    • This reply was modified 2 years, 6 months ago by psyopticon psyopticon.
    #624617
    Tom Dalpra
    Tom Dalpra
    Participant

    I’m certainly no expert on horse-racing, and find the sport thoroughly boring, but it’s difficult to believe that this race wasn’t rigged.

    The way the race panned-out wasn’t really very strange. The National fences have become less daunting over the years due largely to so many casualties in the past and no longer is it a race of guaranteed ‘carnage’ which used to guarantee a big reduction in the field.

    The ground was testing yesterday and therefore the race wasn’t run at a breakneck pace, either. The jockeys sensibly ‘hunted’ round in order to preserve the stamina of their horses.
    In this way the race developed as we might expect any long distance National Hunt race – with a big field – to develop. The winners only pulled away at the business end of the race. It didn’t look strange to me based on the thousands of National Hunt races I’ve watched.

    Of course, racing is full of ‘fixing’. On a daily basis horses run all over the country in races where the jockey is instructed to ‘take it easy’ in order to get the handicap mark of the horse down. In this way horses are set up for races all the time. The handicapping system assures this behaviour.
    All manner of fixing and fiddling and bending of rules goes on within ‘The Sport of Kings’ on a daily basis.

    Earlier on this thread I talked about a horse at Royal Ascot last Summer called Waterloo Bridge who won the first race in front of the Queen on the anniversary of The Battle of Waterloo. I suggested that was an impressive training performance and was deliberately contrived. I’m open to these things.

    That said, the Grand National would be a tough race to fix with any degree of certainty, I think. A horse could make a bad mistake, fall or get brought down in that race, quite easily. There would have to be a fair dose of luck involved with any fix in that race.

    The media always ‘looks for the story’ with the National Winner. Cancer survivor Bob Champion and Aldaniti spring to mind. Quite often potential stories are hyped-up, but don’t always materialise.

    This years story is that Mouse Morris having lost his son last year, won both the Irish and English Grand Nationals. The media has naturally latched-on to it, they have their story. The hype is to be expected at this point.

    I would have liked to have had the inside track from the stable prior to the race
    as I’m sure they had real hopes and thought they had a chance of winning, but I don’t think it was a ‘big establishment fix’ as you seem to suggest Pstyopticon, because in a race of that nature I don’t think it’s possible to do it with any great confidence.

    DalTampra

    #624668
    Nemesis
    Nemesis
    Participant

    A fix, never….

    #624766

    xileffilex
    Participant

    Hmm CO poisoning in Argentina. Reminded me of Jonathan Moyle in Chile for some reason.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jonathan_Moyle

    I did watch the video of the 2016 Grand National and it seemed, aside from the tricky job of keeping jockey and horse together over 9 minutes, especially with both of them tiring, that the leading trio of riders really were trying to win very hard.

    #624863
    Tom Dalpra
    Tom Dalpra
    Participant

    Haha. Well, the 2013 Derby was won by a horse called Ruler of the World.

    It does make you think.

    There are lots of horses with names like that, though.
    It’s seen as a good idea to have a grand and powerful sounding title when naming a horse. It’s taught as horse racing ‘science’ I believe. ”Don’t give your horse a stupid name, give it something with some clout. Then it really might be a world beater”.
    The phrase ”Rule the World” is meaningful here to us because it seems a hint at the hidden hand that we see really does ”rule the World” but it could perhaps just be a typical horses name in an elitist world ?

    On the 33 -1 sp, again, it makes you think.
    Looking at the history of the winning prices in the Grand National we find that in the last 20 years 33-1 and 7-1 are the most common winning prices, each having occurred four times. There’s been three 10-1’s and two 16-1’s and two 25-1’s.

    This number of 33-1 winners could be seen as indicative of the races having been fixed, but when we look at yesterdays race we find that of the 39 runners, ten of them were 50-1 shots, then six of them were 33-1. There were then four 40-1’s and three 16-1’s.
    If you’d stuck a pin in the race card, you’d have a fair chance of hitting a 33-1 shot. It’s a common Grand National price.

    I don’t mean to be pedantic but I’m wary not to jump to the wrong conclusion when seeing things like a suggestive name and another 33 after such a big race and calling ”fake!”.

    Promising race horses are given that sort of name and 33 -1 is a common price.
    This is perhaps a reflection of the world we live in rather than a direct evidence of a specific contrivance.

    I just read that back and I sound like a pedant. I don’t mean to.
    These things are put in our faces, sometimes, of course.
    When the talk of the tea break across the land was the two record 33 million British lottery tickets recently, the two big televised midweek football matches finished 3 -3.
    That seemed like a pretty impressive reference to me.

    DalTampra

    #627221
    psyopticon
    psyopticon
    Participant

    the Grand National would be a tough race to fix with any degree of certainty, I think. A horse could make a bad mistake, fall or get brought down in that race, quite easily. There would have to be a fair dose of luck involved with any fix in that race.
    ..
    I don’t think it was a ‘big establishment fix’ as you seem to suggest Pstyopticon, because in a race of that nature I don’t think it’s possible to do it with any great confidence.

    Hmm. I remain unconvinced. Yours is a similar argument to the 9/11 Hoax, Tom:

    “Can’t believe it was a Controlled Demo — too much to go wrong — too big — too many people to find out.”

    Besides, how hard is it to actually keep a horse on course, over a couple dozen fences? Isn’t that what they’re trained to do? Especially if, for most of the race, they’ve all been instructed to hold back?

    What are we looking at here, though? The rigging of the winner? Perhaps, from the bookmakers’ perspective, what’s more important is rigging the losers. Ensuring the horses with the most wagered on them all go on to ‘lose’ the race?

    Big question: is rigging actually worth it? Well, the runners in this year’s National supposedly had £200 million gambled on them; the largest amount ever. Is that a lot, in the great scheme of things? I honestly don’t know.

    How else could the finances of horse-racing pan out? Do we ‘read’ bookmaking as we should do fakery in the insurance industry? Where the swindling – in terms of psyops, dramatic deaths and other disaster hoaxing – is done at a higher (underwriting) level; through re-insurance; and even at the controlling Council level of Lloyd’s of London.

    What I’m saying is that when a race is rigged, maybe we shouldn’t be looking at it from the viewpoint of an in-the-know punter – who obviously wants to wager on the winner-to-be.

    Instead, look at it from the bookie (like the underwriter) who’s out to fleece everyone with cash in his wallet (whether punters or Names). Enticing as many as possible to back any of the losers.

    While horse-racing is beyond stultifying, at least for me, the personality and background of Mouse Morris remains intriguing.

    From his painful TV interview with the ghastly Clare Balding, Morris comes across as something of a bumpkin. How far from the truth. In fact he’s very well connected; very posh, very well bred.

    “Mouse” is the second son of the 3rd Lord and Lady Killanin. His dad, the 3rd Lord was Eton and Oxbridge-educated; born in London; career on Fleet Street; peerage inherited from uncle; long military career; MBE. Not particularly Irish at all. Very much an Anglophile.

    With pedigree like that, it’s probably a bullshit story about his father (Mouse’s grandfather) being “killed in action near Villers-Cotterêts, France, on 1 September 1914 while commanding the Irish Guards.” (wiki).

    And he has an extensive military career (“war-balls”) of his own to boast about. “Even helped plan D-Day and the Battle of Normandy”. Did he now?

    Most interesting is that Mouse’s father, also called Michael Morris, was President of the International Olympic Committee. With family like that, Mouse is well placed to know how sport really works, as I said. And trusted to shut-the-fuck-up and make the most of it.

    Mouse’s father was also “Honorary Consul-General of Monaco in Ireland from 1961 to 1984.” Which must have opened his eyes to a fair flow of funny-money. Setting the family up well for horse-racing, maybe?

    Maybe that’s another slant we should explore. That horse-racing itself is perhaps tertiary to the importance of money-laundering in gambling. The casinos are famous for that. The money actually wagered on the roulette wheels is dwarfed by the dirty-money that floods in from the drug trade and other crime networks. All those used banknotes getting washed and legitimised through the casino accounts.

    Aside: I’ve got this working theory – expounded on LRF – that the high street bookies – at least in the UK – are taking almost no real money from gamblers. Except on big events like the National. The rest of the year they’re perpetually empty. Even on Saturday afternoons, once their busiest times. Yet as a kid I can remember them bursting with excitement; literally packed out.

    Nowadays though, the punters are all gone. The Andy Capp generation is dead and buried. And younger people mostly aren’t interested in horse-racing. Preferring other forms of gambling, if gambling all. Mainly online, virtual fruit machines and other easily-rigged silliness.

    So why are the high street bookmakers still open for business? Now here’s my speculation: they’re continuing to launder dirty money through the branches, albeit where the ‘creative accounting’ is actually done by head office. Keeping the branches open as a cover, or perhaps a concession. Engaged we may be in systemic criminality, at least we’re providing employment?

    Back to Mouse though, and the tragic loss of his son Tiffer, in Argentina, to CO poisoning.

    Remember in the articles above, we were told that a neighbour was alerted to Tiffer’s plight, by water leaking out from under his apartment door.

    Yet in this article from the Limerick Leader – (which incidentally loves its “missing per” psyops) – the leaking water narrative has vanished.

    From http://www.limerickleader.ie/news/news/144193/Mum-s-grief-at-Tiffer-s.html

    Instead, we’re told that a friend Michelle just happened to call at Tiffer’s apartment but couldn’t raise an answer. Which alerted her to a problem. No mention of any water leak.

    “Michelle [“Fernandez, in whose band Tiffer had performed”]… explained that she had become concerned when she hadn’t heard from either Tiffer or Munra since the concert, so went to the apartment to check on them.

    “She knew they were in, as she could hear their phones ringing and could see their wallets on the sitting room table, through the window,” said Shanny [Tiffer’s mother and Mouse’s wife]. Michelle called the police, who arrived promptly, and they broke down the door to discover the tragedy.

    No mention of any water. There’s another curiosity, too. We get repeated, if brief, references to Tiffer and his pop band. “He was a percussionist” lamented Mouse. “Played the drums” But we never learn his band’s name; nor even its musical genre. Is that realistic?

    And we also get no potted quotes from Tiffer’s friends in Argentina; fellow band members, and so. No one telling us how much they loved and miss him. Yet he’d supposedly been there for two months. Being such a wonderfully popular fella, surely he’d have a big circle of chums?

    And almost no photos to show for his existence either. One from early childhood – of an infant kissing mama [Shanny]. Very easily ‘shopped. Or else showing another child; possibly “brother” Jamie.

    Plus a few more on Facebook. One in front of Brighton(?) pier. ‘Shopped again? And a couple from his supposed travels in Argentina. Again, ‘shoppable. Curiously no photos of his life in between then. None of him growing up. Not a single family photo. Nothing of him with beloved dad Mouse, and just that one with brother Jamie, from 25+ years previous.

    From Shanny’s FB page: https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10153864092846465&set=ecnf.645041464&type=3&theater

    Vanishingly few photos for 30 years of life, is it?

    And Facebook takes an even greater role than normal in the narrative. Get this…

    Supposedly the Morris family first learned about Tiffer’s death from a posting on Facebook. For Christ’s sake! To hell with diplomatic consuls who routinely handle deaths overseas. And do so with the utmost sympathy and discretion. These are the social media end-times where families now learn of sudden deaths from a random tweet or a facebook post.. huh? wtf? lol!

    “He had just performed on stage in Mendoza on the Saturday night. He passed away on the Sunday having come home from the concert. A friend found them,” Shanny explained.

    Tiffer was found lying on a bed. Shanny became aware of her son’s passing early on June 2.

    “At 6am we were informed that a message was posted on Tiffer’s Facebook page asking for a member of his family to phone Mendoza urgently as there had been an accident,” she recalled.

    Really? They were informed of Tiff’s dead via his facebook page? But surely, the cops in Argentina would use “Michelle” to make sympathetic contact with the family. After all “Michelle” knew Tiff. She could formally identify his body. Cops also had ID in the form of the deceased’s mobile phone and the contents of his wallet. So what’s with informing the family via Facebook?

    What a load of horse-poop.

    —-

    Last thing, flicking through the FB pages of Mouse Morris and mother Shanny Clark, one is immediately struck by:

    (a) the absence of any mention at the time of Tiffer’s death. Isn’t that odd?

    (b) the number of posts they makes about other psyops and hoaxes. Taunting us? Or finding comfort and reassurance in these? Hoaxers of the world unite, as it were?

    https://www.facebook.com/michael.morris.140193

    “Michael Morris shared Lucia Dawson-Stanley’s post.
    26 March at 12:36 ·
    Lucia Dawson-Stanley’s photo.
    Lucia Dawson-Stanley
    22 March at 22:02 ·

    *** Please read and share***
    As most people know on Sunday the 20th of March, the tragic news of a vehicle slipping off the end of a pier at Buncrana, County Donegal lead to the death of five members of the McGrotty family…..”


    (Mouse plugs the San Bernadino Shooting Hoax)

    #627808
    Tom Dalpra
    Tom Dalpra
    Participant

    Hmm. I remain unconvinced. Yours is a similar argument to the 9/11 Hoax, Tom:

    “Can’t believe it was a Controlled Demo — too much to go wrong — too big — too many people to find out.”

    Sure, I’m wary of that and I must say, remain unconvinced, either way, exactly. I hear that line all the time.

    That said, I have some insight into horse racing having followed it for some years. I really got the bug working for Ladbrokes as a boardmarker ( pre digital odds came over audio, I wrote them down ) for 18 months in 1989, and for three years prior to that, i’d worked at Newmarket race meetings. I was quite into it, as an interest, for part of my life.
    You confess that you find horse racing ‘beyond stultifying’ Psy. That’s fair enough.
    The idea that every jockey in the race would be in on the fix is a fair enough question from one who is stultified by the sport, but in reality, that wouldn’t be how it worked.
    That would be a case of ”Too many people to find out”.

    Yes, the sport is bent. Yes, all the jockeys know it, really, BUT, a lot of the time they’re trying very hard. The sport wouldn’t exist without that integrity of true competition existing on some sort of level quite a lot of the time.

    ”Could they fix the Grand National ?” is a fair question and it does interest me.
    My concern is that the idea that ‘every jockey was in on it’ is instantly debunkable to anyone who really knows about racing and disinformative as to the true nature of the fixes which go on (and of the sport in general). There are a whole bunch of jockeys and trainers that dream of winning the Grand National each year and who really try hard in the race. That’s for sure.

    You also wrote that the way the race panned-out looked suspicious. It didn’t to me. It looked quite normal. The race may well have been ‘fixed’ but that just wasn’t evidence of it as I see it.

    —————–

    Regarding your the idea that ” the high street bookies – at least in the UK – are taking almost no real money from gamblers” my take is a bit different.

    Introduced in 2001 I would say the Fixed Odds Betting Terminals, the machines that you mention, have been a huge source of income for high street bookmakers and this is ongoing.
    Called the “crack cocaine” of gambling’ by critics it has changed the way people gamble in betting shops and it always looked like a boom for the bookies to me. People can throw away thousands in relatively short time, and often do. I know a guy who lost a quarter of a million pounds gambling on roulette in the bookies ( yes, it’s totally on grid and controllable ) and I hear stories and see people ‘doing their dough’, all the time.
    The saddest story I can relate from personal experience is of a fairly simple but gentle guy Paul I knew who developed a habit on the roulette machines when they first appeared and ended up stealing from his loved ones and then killing himself in shame. They screwed him up and made him sick. Contemporary politically correct marketing attaches the responsible gambling assertion. BETSAFE , ‘gamble responsibly’. These tweakings to gambling promotion are understandable after it could be said a ‘dark horse bolted’ rather with the 2001 introduction of the FOBT. (Fixed Odds Betting Terminals. ‘Fobs’, to some, weirdly ) not to mention the growth of online gambling since.

    As you suggest, the Andy Capp generation is nearly ”dead and buried” – at least not what it used to be – but gambling habits have changed, they haven’t gone away. The gambling culture is alive and very well, if the constant bombardment of bookmaker commercials on our television screens and the queues for the gambling terminals is anything to go by. Jeez, feckin ITV has live roulette every night! Haha. It’s a bit absurd isn’t it, but it appears to pay the bills one assumes?

    It looks like the high street bookies shops in the UK, can fund themselves with a few machines and a sprinkling of over the counter custom whilst maintaining a high street front for the trusted brands like Ladbrokes and Coral who obviously do plenty of business online too these days.
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3416604/Crack-cocaine-gambling-machines-make-1-000-week-Profits-fixed-odds-terminals-said-rocketed-past-year.html

    ————–

    Perhaps we can agree that horse Racing in general is as bent as a nine bob note and the whole money- laundering-machine that it is, goes rolling on. It’s another microcosm of society – from the sad, weekly rent-squandering addict in the high street bookies to the semi interested, dressed-up toff in the box at Royal Ascot, (or perhaps a ‘man who can scarcely string a coherent sentence together’ in the paddock at Aintree )

    ————-

    DalTampra

    #628122

    xileffilex
    Participant

    Time for a timely tweet from Mouse; 10 months have passed.

    Michael Morris shared a link.
    Yesterday at 08:59 ·

    http://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/christopher-morris-son-horse-trainer-5813999
    June 3 2015

    Christopher’s brother Jamie paid an eloquent tribute to his beloved brother on Facebook: “It is with unimaginable sadness that I have to inform you of the passing away of my beloved brother and best friend.
    “He died peacefully due to carbon monoxide poisoning in Argentina. There’s going to one hell of gig in heaven tonight with tiff on the drums and cooking up a feast.
    “God must have heard about his cooking skills and taken him from us for himself ! Love you always bro xx”.

    Jamie seems almost overcome with joy. A very upbeat statement.

    And why, only this week, was the cause of death still given as a suspected case of carbon monoxide poisoning?

    https://www.inotices.ie/in/death-notice/christopher-tiffermorris828369792

    The death has occurred of:
    Christopher (Tiffer) MORRIS

    (Everardsgrange, Fethard, Co Tipperary and South Green, Kildare); he will be deeply missed by Michael (Mouse), Shanny and Jamie, other relatives and large circle of friends. Funeral in the Holy Trinity Church of Ireland, Fethard, Co Tipperary on Wednesday 17th June at 2 o’c. No flowers please.

    Follow


    mccarthyfethard ?@winedinebury
    #fethard#tiffer#funeral .extra parking behind McCarthys during funeral today of Christopher Morris. Back gate to Church open by Town Wall
    1:49 a.m. – 17 Jun 2015 [Pacific Time]

    McCarthy’s Pub Restaurant Undertaker in Fethard Co Tipperary Ireland. Est 1847. 5th Generation Family Business.

    Fethard Co Tipperary Ireland
    Their slogan-“We’ll wine you, dine you and bury you”.

    http://mccarthyshotel.net/page1/index.php

    mccarthyfethard ?@winedinebury
    #RuleTheWorld #mousemorris #grandnational #fethard We did have a bit of a party on Sunday
    2:11 p.m. – 12 Apr 2016

    #634420
    Terran Downvale
    Terran Downvale
    Participant

    I dunno. M&M, 18= 666. You have to wonder. Did “Erin Vandyke” take one for the team?

    http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nascar-from-the-marbles/woman-hit-by-kyle-busch-s-car-at-bristol-made-precautionary-hospital-visit-144613770.html

    Reminds me of this other tripping Van Dyke. Even the arrangement of the bystanders is similar: https://howsweetitwas.wordpress.com/2015/09/21/the-story-of-dick-van-dyke-and-the-ottoman/

    Well, whaddya know. A “Kyle Busch Stealth Chair & Ottoman.” Discontinued, lol: http://mstore.nascar.com/Kyle_Busch_Gear/XZipit_Kyle_Busch_Stealth_Chair_And_Ottoman

    OK, this is getting even weirder now. Both versions of the opening of The Dick Van Dyke Show where he trips over the ottoman and side-steps it are 18 seconds long!


    UPDATE: Now I’m wondering if this scene with the car hitting the lady could be a reference to the “Jack Ruby butt melt” seen here:

    And discussed in this CF thread: http://cluesforum.info/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=1714

    According to Wiki, Jack Ruby shot Oswald at 11:21: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lee_Harvey_Oswald#Death

    I see an 11 18 next to the race car. Am I reaching too far with this one?

    #637355

    xileffilex
    Participant

    We now read that boxer Nick Blackwell [see above posts] is to retire after suffering a “bleed on his skull”.
    http://www.itv.com/news/west/story/2016-04-19/boxer-blackwell-to-retire-thats-me-done/
    Boxer Blackwell to retire: ‘that’s me done’

    What’s that, you might ask?
    http://metro.co.uk/2016/04/04/boxer-nick-blackwell-wakes-from-coma-after-chris-eubank-bout-5794720/
    April 4 2016

    In further good news it has also been revealed that the boxer didn’t suffer a bleed on the brain, but actually a more minor bleed on the skull.

    Which sounds very like
    http://familydoctor.org/familydoctor/en/diseases-conditions/traumatic-brain-injury.html

    A scalp or facial hematoma is bleeding outside the skull that collects and clots, often forming a firm lump on the scalp or forehead. A black eye is another type of hematoma that forms when there is bleeding under the skin around the eye. While these hematomas can look bad, they usually heal without any permanent damage.

    • This reply was modified 2 years, 6 months ago by  xileffilex.
    #637357

    xileffilex
    Participant

    I dunno. M&M, 18= 666. You have to wonder. Did “Erin Vandyke” take one for the team?
    I see an 11 18 next to the race car. Am I reaching too far with this one?

    Advertising gold. Beats winning the race.

    #637599
    Tom Dalpra
    Tom Dalpra
    Participant

    ”firm lump on the scalp or forehead. A black eye is another type of hematoma that forms when there is bleeding under the skin around the eye. While these hematomas can look bad, they usually heal without any permanent damage”.

    Ah, so he didn’t have a bleed on the brain, he had a black eye. And he wasn’t in a coma, he was on drugs.

    Meanwhile, Eubanks Jr’s profile grows. Like his father before him he ‘put a man in a coma’.

    DalTampra

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