how did a nurse commit such unthinkable murders?

[Samson79]

It's doubtful that she's received anything approaching a fair trial, and this could ultimately be one of the biggest miscarriages of justice in known human history.

You seem to think there is a real person, victims, court, etc. .

Where did you get that idea from? I simply posted other peoples findings that oppose or question the msm narrative, using their own reasoning, even the viruses part I also doubt, but benefit of the doubt goes to anyone who is consistant and openly outlines their own reasoning, ie...has it ever occured to you that these comments might be valuable but you can effectively dismiss them because the writer, honest in this case, is simply lacking knowledge on viruses but everything else is actually well reasoned out?

That means you can find cause of doubt and be helping the msm while holding a counter view simultaniously, which imho is a technique used by governments, you can play the skeptic while discrediting valuable information writen by your political opponants simply by seeding doubts, while keeping your camourflage as a skeptic.

Its called throwing the baby out with the bath water.

You commented on the virology but never said you agreed with the major percentage of what was being offered up for scrutiny anyway.

I don't know everything about everything, nobody does.
The observation for me is who is more honest in their intentions to challenge media fakery.

Many get caught out by the simple fact they cannot reason outside of their principle modus operandi which is to pick at someone till they can create doubts only, then they show themselves unwilling to go that small step further by correcting the smallest inconsistancy and evaluating the merits of the whole message being conveyed. I rarely see people do it, not even for the sake of truth. The concept of ultimate knowledge is a given while human error is to be pounced on at every oportunity. Witness testimony is biblically 2 or more due to human error, Jury requires 12 because of human error, so why judge one mans evidence, why not judge multiple peoples reasoning on the same issue instead of hiding amidst human error.....which btw can be counted on!!
Strange.

[YouCanCallMeAl]

Im open to the idea it is all fake, including all the profiles here, this forum, even the idea everything must be fake.....seems fake, so Im open to the idea, yes.

Not everything is fake. But I guess it depends on what you mean by 'everything'.

However, your quoting me as saying something.... I didnt, I linked to someone commenting on the idea of a post it note somehow being evidence of a confession. I posted the link above it to where it was written which shows who wrote it and whos opinions it shows, I did not write that, you assumed I did.

Perhaps you don't realise, but as well as old fashioned quotes, there is a quote format option to indicate whether something is a quote. In the post I linked to (viewtopic.php?p=10493#p10493) it seems to me that you say:

Narratives are in the control grip of the media.
It is simply a one directional comm. Everything you see or watch has to be assumed fake/staged until it is proven as true, what ever is being projected it is not up for debate or framed to be questioned, so it wouldn't be to far fetched to use their own game against them, which is guilty until proven innocent...

etc. I assumed that because there were no quote marks or attribution. But from your statement, I take it you're saying that this is not you. If that's it, as you don't indicate that it is a quote nor attribute who the quote is from, I think I ought to be excused for thinking it was a personal statement of yours. Or perhaps there is some further confusion?

Im also open to the idea this didn't happen, sure, everything posted in this forum could be fake, the content could be theatre, the users could be AI generated (they are all over the internet) but you have only seeded the idea so far, evidenced by your opinion it likely is fake because:

"it has lots of media event elements to it - the name, the numbers, the photos, the reference to other media operations"

So using your same logic, most of this forum's content is based on interpretations of names, numbers, photos all referenced to other media operations......so some of which have yet to be evidenced as having happened but by simply using group-think some of these events are imho still based in opinion and reasoned hunches, or not given the same scrutiny in any given amount.

That's not my logic, that's just you misunderstanding my logic. But I will take the opportunity to clarify what I think.

I would say there are degrees of potential fakery. When it comes to MSM sources such as the BBC, that is a different level to say people discussing this or that on a forum. I'd say it would be hard to argue that we on this forum are in any meaningful way 'guiding the narrative'. Especially in comparison to the BBC's far stronger and broader guidance.

Neither of us attended court, we might travel past our local court and realise it is real and has been there for years in the same place as it always has, but Ive not seen the court in another town or city, but to propose the court in another town or city doesnt exist or is fake is delusional to someone who attended, documented their attendance and that being only disseminated via media in your opinion would make it fake, especially if your focusing on something else....

Well, I'm going to quote the person that you say isn't you, as I think the auto-hoax position they espoused is the right one:

Everything you see or watch has to be assumed fake/staged until it is proven as true.

Here however, you are saying that the event is true, but that Lucy Letby has been set up in some way, that some alternative interpretation of science that partially uses virology, shows that the event wasn't as we are told. I wanted to understand how you came to that conclusion, why you believe this alternative science take, etc.

Are you open to the idea that projecting everything as fake because of numbers or photos or being linked to media can damage peoples perceptions of reality by making it seem something that is real isn't but groups of people can agree they are and produce content past that point to discredit very real events, effectively making it harder for outsiders to gain truth of the matter?

That's quite a confusing question and I'm not certain I grasp what you are saying. I think the thrust of it is: 'if I say everything is fake I could mislead people into questioning something that was actually true!' If that's it, you are accusing me of proposing a skeptical position on all information, even info that might be true but is unproven!

In that case - I find myself guilty as charged! I really do suggest that people do not assume that whatever-it-is is true unless they personally verify it. I've said so for years. And I would include forum posts, MSM articles and events, one's own experience to some extent, and even the Bible (shock, horror!) as sources that one should be skeptical of. I say, far better to take a skeptical position that the auto-believing one, as it saves one wasting so much time chasing up nonsense!

I still want to understand your basis for believing the alternative take on this trial to be true. Why do you stand by this virologist's claim that it couldn't have been Lucy Letby?

[Samson79]

"Why do you stand by this virologist's claim that it couldn't have been Lucy Letby?"

Again, I don't and haven't made any definitive claim I know if she did or did not, I posted someone elses opinions opposing the msm version giving credible reasons why statistically she has suffered an unfair trial, and why...keep up AI kinda guy, before you were saying "I would say there are degrees of potential fakery."

Your degrees of fakery shows exactly how and why you fall short.
Because, something is either fake or not.

All you can do is make assumptions while trying to palm off your own half baked theories, yet you don't hold yourself upto the same level of scrutiny as you do me, but I see patterns in your algorithm that expose your own thinking.

Not difficult either:

"In that case - I find myself guilty as charged! I really do suggest that people do not assume that whatever-it-is is true unless they personally verify it. I've said so for years"

Which reads to me, if I lie because Im an AI kinda guy, its your fault for not knowing!

Nice double-speak

Why not just offer what you are able to definitively verify then, which you don't with your birdbox pet theory.

[YouCanCallMeAl]

Feel free to think and do what you like - let neither logic not reasoning bother you. I'm sure it won't. You're going to enjoy this forum.

[Samson79]

Feel free to think and do what you like - let neither logic not reasoning bother you. I'm sure it won't. You're going to enjoy this forum.

It's no good copying and pasting or pulling out my quotes and dropping them into other threads, unrelated or out of context either, your not letting logic or reasoning come between your own pet theories, so who cares, especially when you try to gain the moral high ground and become trapped in your own lies in the process or try to be-little someone for posting their experiences and asking people to make sense of them in a respectful manner. Lacks empathy imho.

You won't escape being switched off in the future yourself, so why not be nice and use the opportunity to acknowledge we are all on similar paths at different stages of knowledge, your interactions with me have only proved your more for antagonism than anything else, that is my pet theory.

[Samson79]

Another "observation" about this case.

It's length.

Spanning almost a decade and has been waiting in the wing and "marinating" in the background to fill in the gap between the last media assualts on the peoples minds, with Covid and then of course Ukraine (with a liberal sprinkling of other media wierdness inbetween....ie woman in river etc).

What I have observed is with a massive amount of prep and investment into the vaccination drive, also now we are living in the "aftermath" (record low confidence in government infastructure, healthcare, leadership, trust, faith in the political scheme, justice system etc etc)...

People like myself and certainly others here, in fact millions if not hundreds of thousands of us....have seen, felt and had enough.
Have never been more well equiped to "anticipate" the false flag nature of media spin, fakery and even the methodolgy and psychology used as it all tended up until now to follow very strict protocols, coupled with rigid new rules.....people are able to anticipate and counter lies more quickly.
What Im observing is in the past it was generally the working class that was the primary aim at creating compliance in populations, stealing peoples efforts or harnessing labour, which has been destroyed and exported leaving them being the less financially prepared or in the worst enviroment to take advantage of making sense of the massive assault on their quality of life, their freedoms and overall acceptance of all the changes effecting them....but what to do with them?

However, after Covid we now have seen a few "counter punches", whistle blowers, skeptics, general awakeness (in its general term of meaning politically) as the anticipated effects of covid have been far reaching into just about every walk of life, every class system and on multiple levels of cognitive ability.

This means it has never been a better time to have upper class and middle class people anticipating government manouvres in law making and the resulting expected ineptitude in the lying demonic clique enjoying complete privacy in their day to day actions, I think this is why some people, mainly researchers are able to more quickly counter some of the more previously relied upon techniques used in narrative conception and how it is applied, we are seeing less and less help from people to aid and abet government lies, more people aware of complicity, more people aware of how they have been manipulated and the infastructure for government to mentally dope the public is waning because its infastructure is far to heavily invested in or politically rigid it cannot adapt fast enough to the commital and gambit of such a massive event (Covid) that the government cannot simply rely on the same things it has done leading upto this point in history.

Even narratives are rushed out full of holes and with gaps, hastily thought out, all effectively helping our cause in the most unexpected ways, like people involved are trying to save their own skin and this has forced many hands and forced play in to many areas of society, in much much to quick a time frame for simply too many involved to truely know who they can trust.

The desperation to remain relevant in a time with lowest public trust, coupled with countering no opposition upto now has left this whole system open to failures, as it has effected everyone, put dents into the heiarachy, put doubts into the minds of more people who have been previously in control of infastructure, data etc, all the while dealing with the knowledge of how and why they were useful and that they have been played like a fiddle to aid and abet democide, showing only a few were relying on the many, holding counter views and emotions, fixed only for a time due to mutual incentive, which knowledge of governments murdering their own people has put an end to ..at least for cohesiveness, effectively seeing their former trustees as potential political assasins, people cannot sit on a fence that has been kicked down by murderers with lusts far greater than their intelligence.

People are not going to feel as much restraint or remorse in leaking secrets they no longer believe in, people will lose incentives to put themselves in danger for people they now know conclusively had a rope or gun put aside for them.

I think as more and more people notice the veil has dropped the natural stages of disbelief, anger, acceptance and a whole host of other natural emotional and intellectual reactions will result from this, maybe it has been well thought out, scapegoats aplenty, is by design to cause chaos helping the top of the pyramid genuinely want to now consider hiding under a rock for a while, but I don't know about you but I see people are tired of all this and that is the only enviroment needed for a vast majority to take a rest from it all....if you want it...you make it, you fetch it, you drop it off, you deal with it, you sort it out....how can you re-incentivise a persons mind that now knows their life efforts have been taken from them? War? ....nobody will want that. Money? ....what with nothing of any value to spend it on?.....tptb have boxed themselves into a corner.