Lockerbie images 1988

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This topic contains 63 replies, has 7 voices, and was last updated by  xileffilex 2 weeks ago.

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  • #8567

    xileffilex
    Participant

    I just happened to look at some Lockerbie images from the pre-internet age.

    We all know the found bits of plane pics – standard tools in any present-day psy-op – especially those showing a serial number. I’m more interested in the crash scene aerial images:

    http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-7ZTdnUcmbwQ/UPGu0uWvRDI/AAAAAAAADLk/JAYJc74Slo8/s1600/lockerbie-aerial_451371a1.jpg

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/radioscotland/lockerbie.jpg

    http://webra.cas.sc.edu/hvri/image/features/dec2013/panam1.jpg

    91,000 kg of fuel apparently landed here on Sherwood Crescent. We see a large cylindrical hole in the ground, but very little charring if any. Houses in the immediate vicinity are unscathed.

    Some fireball, then.

    http://plane-truth.com/Aoude/geocities/lockpic6.jpg

    http://plane-truth.com/Aoude/geocities/lockpic1.jpg

    http://plane-truth.com/Aoude/geocities/lockpic3.jpg

    http://plane-truth.com/Aoude/geocities/houseshat.jpg

    Article:
    http://plane-truth.com/Aoude/geocities/victim2.html

    “The nosecone and cockpit of the plane, as well as almost 100 bodies, fell on the land of Tundergarth Mains farm.”
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-25061088

    “Mr Gould witnessed the main explosion which would destroy Sherwood Crescent and a big chunk of the fuselage of Pan Am flight 103 which landed on Rosebank Crescent.
    “I remember an oxygen cylinder bounced off our roof and lay spinning around in the road,” he says.
    Mr Gould then assumed it was a collision between two military jets but when he went up to Rosebank Crescent he saw the first of the dead bodies.”

    “There were quite a few bodies in the immediate area in and around the cockpit,” said Ms [Lesley] Smith.[on her farm]
    “There obviously was some bodies inside it. The pilot and the co-pilot were still in there.

    As well as wreckage from one end of the farm to the other, there were about 100 bodies found on their land.

    #8576
    Tom Dalpra
    Tom Dalpra
    Participant

    Well the images seem a bit tiny, but the topic is surely worthy of a thread.

    Gotta love the way key witness, David Gould, managed to get the nuclear fear and fraud in at that time with his ‘nuclear reaction’ if you will. This is funny.
    So there was this big bang…

    ”The immediate thought of Mr Gould was that Chapelcross, the nearby nuclear power station, had exploded.

    He says he went back into his house in Park Place and went up into the timber part at the top which would have offered less protection.

    “With a nuclear blast you don’t want to survive,” Mr Gould says.

    Hahaha. He went home to die a nuclear death in his loft. This was after he heard the bang and the scraping of metal. Then he went home and got in the most exposed part of the house on purpose. Brilliant thinking.

    Curl up and die. As quickly as you can.

    Get the psychic driving in there, while you can, is the deal of course. It doesn’t matter that his story is irrational. He invokes the fake, nuclear, spectre. He shoe-horns it in.

    David Gould – you wombat.

    “You still think now, looking back, if what you saw was real. Sadly it was.”
    -sadly it wasn’t, I feel.
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-25061088

    DalTampra

    #8580
    Tom Dalpra
    Tom Dalpra
    Participant

    PAN AM FLIGHT 103

    Little things I found in the official story:

    Investigators were able to determine that both wings had landed in the crater after counting the number of large steel flap drive jackscrews that were later found there; there was no evidence of the wings found outside the crater itself

    Wow. That was tidy. Most of the aircraft we’re saying then, exploded in a fireball of kerosene in that pit? Yeh? A good part of the body and the wings.
    Remember the engines I suppose. Yeh, sounds like most of the plane disappeared down a hole. Something made a loud band and there was a big hole. They knew all the wings were in there by counting the number of large steel flap drive jackscrews they found(:-) Presumably they found ALL of them. How many was there?

    Another section of the fuselage landed about 1.5 miles (2.4 km) northeast, where it slammed into a home in Park Place. Miraculously, despite the house being completely demolished, its occupant escaped uninjured.

    Miracle escape. Always good for the story. It puts me in mind of that Buster Keaton clip where the house falls down and he’s left standing.

    270 total killed – 11 on the ground
    Eleven Lockerbie residents were killed on the ground when the wing section hit 13 Sherwood Crescent at more than 800 km/h (500 mph) and exploded, creating a crater 47 m (154 ft) long and with a volume of 560 m3 (730 cu yd). The house was completely destroyed, and its occupants, Dora and Maurice Henry, were killed. Several other houses and their foundations were completely destroyed, and 21 others were damaged so badly they had to be demolished. Four members of one family, Jack and Rosalind Somerville and their children Paul, 13, and Lyndsey, 10, died when their house at 15 Sherwood Crescent exploded.’

    Now take this in.

    ‘Kathleen Flannigan, 41, her husband Thomas, 44, and their daughter Joanne, 10, were killed by the explosion in their house at 16 Sherwood Crescent. Their son Steven, 14, saw the fireball engulf his home from a neighbour’s garage, where he had gone to repair his sister’s bicycle. Their oldest son, David, was living in Blackpool at the time. David died in 1993 and Steven in 2000.

    Both of the sons died in their twenties? Really?
    http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2000/aug/27/lockerbie.ameliahill

    So dubious. A family completely …gone…poof!-

    Steven is the final member of a family wiped out in brutal increments by a domino run of disasters that began the night a strange, whistling wind was first heard above Lockerbie that winter’s evening. The body of his 10-year-old sister was eventually found in the 30-foot crater gouged out of Sherwood Crescent, but his parents, blasted into pieces too tiny to recover, were never found.”

    Now what does that remind me of?

    Gadaffi gave 2.16 BILLION US DOLLARS in compensation to the victims of Flight 103 in 2003.. -that’s eight million per person.

    DalTampra

    #8591

    xileffilex
    Participant

    Very poor supply of images, surprisingly or perhaps unsurprisingly:
    Some of those small ones are from a defunct site
    http://web.archive.org/web/20010424103528/http://www.panamair.org/lockerbieimagestown.htm
    , replicated here:
    http://www.panamair.org/OLDSITE/lockscotimages.htm

    The exploding fuel tanks left a “crater 155 feet long and 40 feet wide [aerial view about 1.00 in the video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GP0_ilSYnhE

    body on the roof at 2.03…..I still see no evidence for a fireball, apart from burnt out cars. Subsequently 70 bodies are dug out of the ruin’s of the home of Ella Ramsden, 71 Park Place!!! Remarkable survival story [how?]
    Pan Am Flight 103 | Lockerbie Disaster (Part 3)

    Park place, where nobody died, was where a significant part of the fuselage landed, apparently. James Startkey at #64 in his shed described the flames as like “red snow” ! Get that.
    [source: Book – Elegies of Darkness by Dee Britton]

    LOCKERBIE, Scotland Dec 18 [1998 anniversary] (Reuters) – Ella Ramsden was left with nothing but her dog when Pan Am flight 103 obliterated her house and left 60 corpses strewn across her back garden.
    http://plane-truth.com/Aoude/geocities/ramsden98.html

    This is some way from the alleged fuel tank explosion and crater.

    Some witness accounts here, from 2008,
    http://www.scotsman.com/news/twenty-years-on-lockerbie-remembers-night-without-end-1-1152443
    from the book An’ then the world came tae oor doorstep: Lockerbie Lives and Stories by Jill S Haldane, published by the Grimsay Press, priced 16.95.
    Hmmmmm This needs looking at more closely.

    The video footage shows many classic psy-op ingredients we have come to recognise well

    #8609
    Tom Dalpra
    Tom Dalpra
    Participant

    Oh there’s some really familiar sounding stuff reading about Lockerbie.

    Check out retired inspector George Stobbs in 1998 on the occasion of the 10th anniversary.

    Retired inspector George Stobbs, who at the time was running the smallest
    police force in Britain, said: “It was like being in a film scene, like those 3-D
    images coming towards you.

    And this: –

    Stobbs, sipping tea in his farmhouse outside Lockerbie, said he would never
    forget the sight of a wrought-iron gate melting in the heat from the giant fireball
    created by the fuselage and wings crashing onto Lockerbie.

    “The heat was so intense, it was actually melting,” he said.

    To some, the giant fireball into the sky looked like the mushroom cloud of a
    nuclear bomb. The impact was so great it registered 1.6 on the Richter scale.

    http://plane-truth.com/Aoude/geocities/ramsden98.html

    The melting metal bit looks carefully planted, for three years later.

    ”LOCKERBIE, Scotland Dec 18 [1998 anniversary] (Reuters) – Ella Ramsden was left with nothing but her dog when Pan Am flight 103 obliterated her house and left 60 corpses strewn across her back garden.”

    What a terrible night that must have been. 60 dead bodies in your garden? Lordy, lordy, who needs it? Let alone the house getting completely obliterated. Oh well, at least she and the dog were fine.

    DalTampra

    #8623

    xileffilex
    Participant

    [Local government officer Donald Bogie] . His daughter won a scholarship to Syracuse University which lost 35 students in the explosion.
    http://plane-truth.com/Aoude/geocities/ramsden98.html
    How come?
    http://archives.syr.edu/panam/lockerbie/

    As a result of the Pan Am tragedy, Syracuse University maintains a strong bond with Lockerbie, Scotland and its people. A number of SU faculty and staff have visited Lockerbie, and together SU and the Lockerbie Trust offer an annual scholarship for two students from Lockerbie to study at Syracuse University. The collection of Lockerbie, Scotland materials reflects this special relationship between Syracuse University and Lockerbie.

    Materials donated by members of the Lockerbie Community and also by first responders involved in the search and recovery efforts and the following criminal investigation may be found here.

    THis is the response to all the links:

    Collections and Personal Papers
    Lockerbie Collection: Donald T. Bogie Papers

    Donald T. Bogie was instrumental in the early phases of design for the Arlington Memorial Cairn, which was given by the people of Lockerbie to the U.S. families.

    This collection is being processed. If you would like a copy of the current collection index please email the Archivist at pa103archives@syr.edu

    For example:

    George White was a paramedic in Lockerbie in 1988. George is retired and has since moved to the U.S.

    Moved to the US – just like that…

    Dr. Ivan Gibson was a pathologist working on the Pan Am 103 air disaster. He had previously worked in Canada and also in Northern Ireland, where he accumulated some experience with trauma cases.
    Jane Gibson was a radiographer working at the Dumfries Royal Infirmary in 1988. Jane and her colleagues were called upon after the disaster and worked for nearly three weeks, outside the bounds of their normal duties. Jane was also a resident of Lockerbie, Scotland and lived with the tragedy daily.
    Colin Dorrance was a probationary officer with the Dumfries and Galloway in 1988; he was only 18 years old. Colin is a graduate of Lockerbie Academy and was in the town for a party on December 21, 1988 and was one of the first officers on the scene following the crash . Colin is currently a Sergeant with Police Scotland.

    and so it goes on.
    But what about the images/video?

    Lockerbie – Syracuse scholarship info and recipients here:
    http://lockerbieacademy.com/index.php/information-for-parents/item/syracuse-scholarship.html

    Each year, two students are given the opportunity to attend Syracuse University for one academic year. This scholarship was created in memory of those who lost their lives, both in Lockerbie and from Syracuse University (New York State, USA), in the 1988 Lockerbie Air Disaster. Syracuse University and the Lockerbie/ Syracuse Scholarship Trust meet the basic costs of their attendance jointly.

    #8632

    xileffilex
    Participant

    I am astonished how little attention is paid to the destruction depicted in the very few photos of Lockerbie available.

    http://fakeologist.wordpress.com/2013/07/03/twa-flight-800-passenger-list/ ab sad
    a July 3, 2013 at 9:32 pm

    So do you think the big ones, like Lockerbie, Swissair, and Air India were fake? I agree, with the military media’s cooperation, anything can be done easily, especially if the plane crash is staged over water. Who can verify anything then?

    Which brings me to this site:
    http://plane-truth.com/pan_am_103.htm
    which identifies a fact/image which today would shout out staged event:

    This photograph is of the remains of the Boeing 747-100’s Section 41 that landed 4.5 miles from the main wreckage on Lockerbie, at a little Scottish village called Tundergarth. This part of the wreckage was the nearest to the Heathrow airport from where it had left. Why would the nose be the first piece to land if a bomb blew a hole in the fuselage in front part of the plane called Section 42, which is located behind Section 41?

    In the next second or so after the initial event, we know that Section 41 separated from Section 42 as it landed in Tundergarth, whereas the main part of the remainder of the debris landed on Lockerbie, some 4-1/2 miles away.

    Since the fragment exited the plane in the initial event and because of the fact that the plane was moving at 550 mph, one should expect the fragment to be closer to the departure point – Heathrow – than Section 41. Depending on the direction and strength of the wind it should be possible to determine how close to Section 41 the fragment should have been. Interestingly enough, if the wind was from the NW, the fragment should be even closer to the departure point than Section 41 as Section 41 would have been less influenced by the wind in its fall.

    Once I have obtained more details about the location of the fragments, I believe it will be possible to write a convincing paper to demonstrate whether or not the fragment could possibly have been where it was found.

    For some unknown reason, Section 41 was stored at Roger Windley’s junkyard in Tattershall, Lincolnshire, U.K. I tried to visit the site to obtain samples of the metal for analysis and was refused. The main fuselage and wings were all stored at Farnborough, Surrey, U.K. where an attempt was made to reconstruct the plane in order to analyze what had happened when the IED exploded.

    I think this says enough to me that perhaps section 41 was placed at the farm.

    There are some online debris scatter plots, but I see no reason to believe their truthfulness

    #10487

    xileffilex
    Participant

    Same old photo used here for the hoax – is that all they have?
    http://aangirfan.blogspot.co.uk/2008/07/iran-to-be-framed-for-lockerbie-did-cia.html

    interesting talk of bodies. Who saw them?

    Tom Dalyell, a member of British Parliament, stated: “…Absolutely swarms of Americans [were] fiddling with the bodies, and shall we say tampering with those things the police were carefully checking themselves. They weren’t pretending, saying they were from the FBI or CIA, they were just ‘Americans’ who seemed to arrive very quickly on the scene.”

    Dalyell recalled: “It was… odd and strange that so many people should be involved in moving bodies, looking at luggage, who were not members of the investigating force. What were they looking for so carefully? You know, this was not just searching carefully for loved ones. It was far more than that. It was careful examination of luggage and indeed bodies.” [1027]

    Dr. David Fieldhouse, the local police surgeon, identified Major McKee’s body. “I knew that [the identification of] McKee was absolutely correct because of the clothing which correlated closely with the other reports and statements, and the computers that were linked up to Washington.” [1028]

    Jim Wilson, local farmer, told relatives of Pan Am victims that he was present “when the drugs were found.” Wilson discovered a suitcase packed with heroin in one of his fields.

    When everyone is probably telling lies, what can one analyses? Not much.

    This is a good image:

    http://www.inquisitr.com/1069815/lockerbie-bombing-25th-anniversary-marked-by-remembrance-ceremonies-in-us-uk/

    #10488
    Tom Dalpra
    Tom Dalpra
    Participant

    Shades of Aberfan and Shanksville there with that great groove in the ground. Clear ‘evidence’ of something dramatic having happened from a distance. Those aerial pictures sent round the world.

    ‘Eleven Lockerbie residents were killed on the ground when the wing section hit 13 Sherwood Crescent at more than 800 km/h (500 mph) and exploded, creating a crater 47 m (154 ft) long and with a volume of 560 m3 (730 cu yd). The house was completely destroyed, and its occupants, Dora and Maurice Henry, were killed. Several other houses and their foundations were completely destroyed, and 21 others were damaged so badly they had to be demolished. Four members of one family, Jack and Rosalind Somerville and their children Paul, 13, and Lyndsey, 10, died when their house at 15 Sherwood Crescent exploded.’

    So a wing section is supposed to have caused that huge groove when it crashed and exploded at 800 mph as well as damaging ‘the foundations of the houses’. They mention this. Echoes here of the Molasses tragedy of Boston when the tank of molasses burst and the sugary wave knocked the fire house off it’s foundations. A sticky end to the old gaff.

    That really stretches the imagination doesn’t it? That field of damage from a wing?
    gf

    DalTampra

    #10491
    Carole Thomas
    Carole Thomas
    Participant

    The Maid of the Seas was already in a bad condition in 1980.

    Scroll down to last comment.
    http://www.airlinereporter.com/2010/12/photo-pan-am-boeing-747-100-maid-of-the-seas/

    Ready for the scrap heap, maybe? Kill two birds with one stone. interesting name that too – Maid of the Seas. Shades of Isis and Mary.

    Whatever reality is, it's not that.

    #10510

    xileffilex
    Participant

    The big give away was that “Maid of the Seas” was so nicely visible in that segment of the fuselage dumped in some remote part of Southern Scotland – they tend to do this with faked helicopter crashes – neat segments bearing the serial number are placed for the eager photojournalists. Where WAS the plane in those Lockerbie pics? That estate looked like it had been cleared for demolition previously.

    here’s a better quality photo of the terrace with what looks like gas/bomb blast damage:

    all that moss on the roof – was it inhabited?

    #10739

    xileffilex
    Participant

    A shill like poster at Icke has just alerted me to a back story website to propagate the Lockerbie myth.
    http://plane-truth.com/Aoude/geocities/victim2.html
    the following topics are in the main text.

    http://plane-truth.com/Aoude/geocities/victim.html

    as with 9/11 …all those lucky survival stories. hmmmm

    oh, the newish Icke poster, busily commenting on a wide range or subjects as they all do to bump up credibilty. Guess what, his wife was a radiologist ex-raying bodies in ~~Lockerbie ice rink. right…..
    http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1062165155&postcount=317

    some new photos in the above site.They shout out psy-op loudly. eg


    standard crash psy-op photo




    where’s the plane?



    http://plane-truth.com/Aoude/geocities/ramsden.jpg

    #10741
    Tom Dalpra
    Tom Dalpra
    Participant

    The standard engine photo. Fresh in from the Ukraine- flight MH 17

    ds

    Here at Lockerbie we see the engine presented in a hole. How cute.
    Did it roll in like a successful golf putt down a pre-excavated hole? Or are we to assume it plummeted down and made the hole? I’d suggest the former.
    ds

    DalTampra

    #10751

    xileffilex
    Participant

    nice comparison, Tom. Wonder how they made that huge hole at Lockerbie. They were well ahead of the curve in 1988. 26 years later, it must be so easy.

    #435222

    xileffilex
    Participant

    Not quite new imagery, but an old favorite does rear its head today….

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-34543983

    Scotland’s Lord Advocate Frank Mulholland QC recently met the US Attorney General, Loretta Lynch, in Washington to review progress made in the ongoing investigation.

    They have now requested permission from the Libyan authorities for Scottish police and the FBI to interview the two named suspects in Tripoli.

    A Crown Office spokesman said: “The Lord Advocate and the US Attorney General have recently agreed that there is a proper basis in law in Scotland and the United States to entitle Scottish and US investigators to treat two Libyans as suspects in the continuing investigation into the bombing of flight Pan Am 103 over Lockerbie.

    “The Lord Advocate has today, therefore, issued an International Letter of Request to the Libyan attorney general in Tripoli which identifies the two Libyans as suspects in the bombing of flight Pan Am 103.
    The Lord Advocate and the US Attorney General are seeking the assistance of the Libyan judicial authorities for Scottish police officers and the FBI to interview the two named suspects in Tripoli.

    Any more emotive photos today? Why certanly

    What else is happening today – the first Conference of the Scottish Nationalist Party since it swept through Scotland at the recent general election. Quelle Coincidence!

    One must get whomever is in power to read and remember the script and keep it developing now Megrahi is off the scene.

    • This reply was modified 2 years, 1 month ago by  xileffilex.
    #457329

    xileffilex
    Participant

    Here’s one I only just came across. Looks very very staged.
    I can’t find any source earlier than this August 2011 blog post.
    https://2012patriot.wordpress.com/2011/08/26/lockerbie-bombing-evidence/

    Local resident, Robert Love, who loved to be photographed by this excavated hole:

    Same spot, isn’t it? Except the barriers haven’t been erected outside the houses.

    Here’s Robert again:

    and again:

    They’ve been upto their tricks for years and years.

    #457330
    Tom Dalpra
    Tom Dalpra
    Participant

    hg

    Ha! Her with the broom – ” A huge bit of rubbish fell on the front drive”

    Note – there was a small sub heading saying ”Just Like Lockerbie” in the Sun newspaper yesterday, when referring to the contemporary Metrojet crash. These things can be milked for years.

    DalTampra

    #457432

    xileffilex
    Participant

    Another one from the Lockerbie fly-tipping incident

    There’s an interesting thread here
    http://www.documentingreality.com/forum/f244/lockerbie-air-disaster-scotland-21-december-1988-a-13601/
    which lists the celebs who managed not to be on the flight, in addition to Pik Botha

    Celebrities

    The R&B singing group The Four Tops had been scheduled to board Pan Am Flight 103 to return to the United States for Christmas after completing their European tour, but were late getting out of a recording session and overslept.

    Punk rock musician John Lydon (Johnny Rotten) of the Sex Pistols and Public Image Ltd. and his wife, Nora, were also booked on Pan Am Flight 103, but missed it due to delays.

    The 1988 world tennis no 1 Mats Wilander had made a reservation but did not take a seat on the flight.

    The actress Kim Cattrall was also booked on the flight but changed her reservation shortly beforehand in order to complete some last minute gift shopping in London and mentioned it during interviews in 2007, an example of which can be read at http://www.contactmusic.com/news.nsf…escape_1034625

    The 9/11 parallels are uncanny. Probably a warm up event, just testing the water.

    • This reply was modified 2 years ago by  xileffilex.
    #457485
    Tom Dalpra
    Tom Dalpra
    Participant

    Probably a warm up event, just testing the water.

    Well, yes, as part of the ongoing program. They got a couple of billion. apparently out of Gadaffi for compensation for it before they took him out.

    I do remember there were reports of melting steel of the gate frames in that estate in Lockerbie with a bit of scary ‘nucular’ bunged-in.

    Stobbs, sipping tea in his farmhouse outside Lockerbie, said he would never
    forget the sight of a wrought-iron gate melting in the heat from the giant fireball
    created by the fuselage and wings crashing onto Lockerbie.
    “The heat was so intense, it was actually melting,” he said.
    To some, the giant fireball into the sky looked like the mushroom cloud of a
    nuclear bomb. The impact was so great it registered 1.6 on the Richter scale.

    It, apparently, all put this guy off his Christmas dinner. It would wouldn’t it?

    http://plane-truth.com/Aoude/geocities/ramsden98.html

    DalTampra

    #464465

    xileffilex
    Participant

    A few MORE OF INTEREST
    http://thescotsmanpublications.newsprints.co.uk/view/22657294/LI1115085@An%20aerial%20view%20of.JPG
    amazing how the nearby houses are immaculate and undamaged.

    It could be Sinai

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About xileffilex

doubter of everything in the MSM – photojournalists especially. Especially interested in the David Kelly suicide psy-op, Diana faked crash, Boston Marathon hoax. Old man with time to read behind the headlines. Southern England

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